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Should I conduct a stripping run for my sugar wash runs?
G’day fellas, I’m on my 5th run now and I’m wondering something…Quick background: I have a reflux condenser and so I’ve stuck to just sugar washes.At the advice of an old brewer, I’ve made sure to carbon filter my diluted spirit. This has come out pretty good and mostly disappears into a drink. My runs include previously collected heads and tails, and my washes have come out around 15-17% using the calc. I currently collect 200-250ml foreshot, 500-650ml heads, around 3500-4000ml hearts, and when the temp goes up a little and I can smell the tails coming, I save about 2100ml tails. Even my 50% tails is beautiful and clear. So I’m already cutting in my first run, and what I’m wondering is:Is it worth rerunning a sugar wash to refine it further, if it’s just neautral spirit and I’m carbon filtering anyway? And if so, would I rerun just the hearts or everything but the FS?
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25 Replies
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Three or four stripping runs to make the low wines for a spirit run is great for most products.
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You will always get a better neutral spirit by running low wines no matter how good or what type of the still.Lots of stills have a reflux condencer, even some of the really badly designed ones, this doesn’t tell us a lot about your particular still.Big booboo right there, keep you washes to around 10% maximum. Don’t be fooled by the rubbish advice of homebrew shops that promote the use of turbo yeast and high abv washes.It all ends in an inferior end product.As above , lower abv washes, good distilling methods, good cuts and you shouldn’t need carbon filtering.Diluting your low wines to 28-30 abv with water helps leave a lot of rubbish that you don’t want in the boiler.
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I’ve only seen it referred to as a reflux condenser (looks like the older “Pure Distilling” version). What I was informed was it’ll stripped most flavour from the wash, which is why I haven’t strayed yet from sugar, and haven’t bought a dome/pot still attachment for my boiler. Fair enough. If I’m limited to “Neutral Spirit” as apposed to Vodka/Rum/Whiskey/etc., What is a good product? It’s been a couple years since I maintained a sourdough started . I have 2 brick’nmortar stores within a 45minute drive, the further one has a bigger range so I might go in and have a yarn about yeast. ATM I don’t have much in the way of temperature control, and as it’s heating up in Australia I was thinking of trying the “heat” turbo yeast from still spirits. I’ve attached my wash graph (excl. 1 outlier that had a much more gradual drop). I roughly go from OG 1.120 to FG 0.994, which is a pretty high abv wash. Without investing more this has been pretty consistent, so changes to the yeast and sugar content (i.e., smaller gravity range) sounds like it might make a difference. Thanks for the feedback mate.
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I’m a little confused, forgive me. Everything from my Foreshots to the first litre of Tails all come out 92-95%, The median is 94%. I’ve been diluting to 40% and running through a carbon filter setup. My boiler is a simple 2000w boiler, so the output is always the same. By “Low Wines” do you mean combining (effectively) my entire run, diluting it down to Low Wines level, and running again? Apologies, I’ve read up a little and done a handful of runs now, but I know I’m barely scratching surface of distilling.
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The stripping runs are done with a pot still, collecting to a desired ABV in the receiver, then diluting, if needed, for the spirit run.
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What I thought a stripping run was, was a run to remove all the yeasty flavours before rerunning to further remove undesired flavour compounds. But if I take just the hearts from the first run, there isn’t much of a flavour in the first place. So I was wondering if there was any point in additional runs if my final product (diluted and filtered) is actually quite drinkable (as a neutral spirit)? I assumed it probably was, but maybe it has diminishing returns and isn’t really worthwhile ..Cheers,Ash
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What I thought a stripping run was, was a run to remove all the yeasty flavours before rerunning to further remove undesired flavour compounds. But if I take just the hearts from the first run, there isn’t much of a flavour in the first place. So I was wondering if there was any point in additional runs if my final product (diluted and filtered) is actually quite drinkable (as a neutral spirit)? I assumed it probably was, but maybe it has diminishing returns and isn’t really worthwhile ..Cheers,AshYes it’s worth it. Do a fast stripping run/runs with a pot still and collect those low wines. Then do a slow spirit run using a decent reflux column and you should get the cleanest neutral possible. Make your cuts and only drink the hearts. All the stuff you don’t drink (feints), some pour into the boiler for the next spirit run or collect until you have enough to do an ‘all feints’ run.Yest it’s worth it because you get to keep more, it’s cleaner/better quality and even what you don’t keep … you get to run again in the future and keep even more. Also what people here have been explaining is standard operating procedure. I really don’t know where people have been misled into thinking a ‘one and done’ run is the thing to do for a clean neutral. I blame YouTube & Facebook though I really don’t know exactly where to point my finger at.4″ VM Build
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If you want the end result of your labours to improve you need to keep away from the homebrew shop and turdbo yeast products.Use this recipe instead, everything is readily available at the supermarket and much cheaper, many here will vouch for this recipe.viewtopic.php?t=70585The advice you’ve got in the past could have been a lot better it seems.
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My setup doesn’t really allow for fast/slow, at least not as far as I know. This dude right here is my setup, along with a 2000w boiler. The only other thing I can think of to control is the water flow, which I have set up to go at around the mark I read it should be (around 90L/min). This keeps my temp when extracting under 79 degrees celsius. If i increase the water flow, will it cool the top end and result in a slower extraction? This setup I cleaned up and have been using is all the experience I’ve had so far . Understood. I’ve been sampling last Sundays labours while wrapping up todays, so I’ll digest that thread before I start my next batch. Cheers mate.
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Unfortunately for you, “The worlds most advanced home spirit maker”, isn’t.
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For what they are your still isn’t to bad, far superior to a lot of what is for sale out there.I’d pick it over a T500 anyday.It’s a LM still, ” Liquid Management “It works on the same principle as the Boka stills that many people here build and run.The difference is that the one you have has a shorter column than what is recommended for that type of still.Don’t worry about that for now, it will still make a reasonable spirit and will teach you a lot in the process.Start with a better wash recipe and read up on making cuts, you will be making a better product before you know it.
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How is the column connected to the lid Ash?Hard to see from the pic on the website. And if it’s possible to remove it, are you willing/able to make a pot still head to fit on it, so you can do fast stripping runs?Make Booze, not War!
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Easier to buy a new/ spare lid , and build a pot head on that , a lid was about 25 bucks Au last time I bought one, could be a bit more now.
Something like that or even more simple is all you need.
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My boiler should be identical to the Still Spirits T500 boiler, it’s just an old thingo called “Beer me/Boil a Beer”. Same lid with the same hole afaik from seeing the T500 kit in store. I originally was going to bash a simple still together before I was given this current equipment, so I might have a read up on this actually, cheers.I actually have 3 boilers/lids and 2 complete columns/condensers etc., so all good on the lid front . I had cleaned them all up, seasoned them, and put one set away for my brother if he eventually wants to get into it too.
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“is a stripping run worth it for my sugar wash runs”Absolutely, the crappier the wash, the more important stripping becomes.If the still isn’t capable of stripping, do a reflux run at the fastest takeoff possible, dilute and run it again.It only takes a little bit of tails in neutral spirits to pollute the flavor.Start with a wash that doesn’t stress the yeast and there will be less tails made during fermentation.Strip, so the majority of the tails stay in the pot to be drained out. Stripping with a little reflux is really good for this. Dilute and redistill so there’s a 2nd chance to get rid of the tails.Even a short column can getter done is used two times.
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My boiler should be identical to the Still Spirits T500 boiler, it’s just an old thingo called “Beer me/Boil a Beer”. Same lid with the same hole afaik from seeing the T500 kit in store. I originally was going to bash a simple still together before I was given this current equipment, so I might have a read up on this actually, cheers.I actually have 3 boilers/lids and 2 complete columns/condensers etc., so all good on the lid front . I had cleaned them all up, seasoned them, and put one set away for my brother if he eventually wants to get into it too.Oh, so you have a “Spare” lid with a column on it, that you could chop up and turn into a stripping setup?If that’s the case, I’d definitely do that.Make Booze, not War!
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Lot of good advice here.Answer to question: YesAdditionally, it appears you have a number of misconceptions which you may have picked up from the youtube videos you are referencing. It will be well worth your time to carefully read through the links below in the “required reading” section to do a little reset. Best of luck!
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Cheers mate. I think the best improvements I’m gonna see (for my current setup), are in the wash tbh. My heat source isn’t exactly controllable, so it all comes out the same (settled Wash, 60-70 minutes to boil, and about 1.5L/hr before tails), so I think my answer is that I can’t exactly do a stripping run at all, not until I build something myself to run it quicker. Yep, sure did! A lot of what I read and heard wasn’t relevant to what I have, namely my extraction is pretty set in stone and I can’t actually do a “stripping run” at all, since it’ll take 6 hours from start to tails regardless (and more to collect tails for recycling). Thanks for all the advice guys!
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Most of us don’t collect ‘tails’ off stripping runs, especially for neutral, shutting down when our target ABV has been reached and dumping the rest.I don’t collect tails off my reflux still. As soon as the ABV drops, I shut down and toss the rest. Recycling your nasty stuff when making neutral is a fools errand.
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What I’ve found so far is my abv carries on quite a bit after I start to smell a change, and the temp rises. So I usually keep at least 1.4L since it’s still high abv. I think I’ve got the point now that my turbo yeast washes have been a bit uh, fast and fat. For example on my last run:
- Foreshot: 91% abv 78.9°C
- Head: 95% 78.9°
- 2500ml hearts: 93% 79°
- 1400ml hearts:94% 79° temp started rising 0.1° every 15 minutes towards the end here
- 700ml “tails”: 94% 79.5°
- 700ml “tails”: 90% 85°
- 700ml “tails”: 68% 95°
I left it going even longer but that was the majority of tails i pulled. It’s so far been over 6L of alcohol content collected from each wash. Most people that have sampled it diluted and filtered to 40% don’t notice any odour etc., but I can and know it can be better,
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I know what you are doing and it’s not something I do. I strip with a pot head, taking a small foreshot to get rid of some ethyl acetate, then strip to the ABV I want, shut down and quickly refill with more wash and strip that.For neutral, I strip the wash to give me 40% ABV, (some stop at 50% and add water), in the boiler for a reflux run, then spirit run it close to azeo with a stable head temperature until the temperature rises 0.3 degrees and it gets shut down. The last bit goes straight into the fuel jar.
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And some strip a whole lot further when stripping for neutral, Yummy and I included.If a reflux still is incapable of separating good ethanol from tails right to the end then it’s hardly worth owning.
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And some strip a whole lot further when stripping for neutral, Yummy and I included.If a reflux still is incapable of separating good ethanol from tails right to the end then it’s hardly worth owning.I do that too. I strip in pot still mode then switch to reflux to pull out the last bit. I clear my wash to make it that much cleaner too.4″ VM Build
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There sure are a lot of ways to strip a wash. I do have a drawing for a hybrid pot/reflux stripping still head that I like the look of, but I doubt I’ll ever build it because the ancient preheater design I used is so time and energy efficient that stripping with the new design would be a step backwards.
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And some strip a whole lot further when stripping for neutral, Yummy and I included.If a reflux still is incapable of separating good ethanol from tails right to the end then it’s hardly worth owning.Absolutely . Been a while since I bothered measuring . But I normally stop when coming off the still is less than 20% and if I can be bothered , down to 10% abv .The reflux still will sort it out later . The combined ABV is up around 30% mark . Thats from a Shady shine …. Not a turdbo .When it comes to refluxing . OK , I’ve been doing this a while , so I have a fare idea when I am getting close to tails . I don’t use a thermometer . I don’t use a Alc meter ….. they all talk shit . When I know it’s about time , I switch from my demijohn back to my 500ml jars . Each jar change , I have a sample on the fly . A bit of water in the spoon and a splash from the spout . .If the jar tastes good , I keep it aside . Sooner or later there will be a change . I switch to half a jar and sample . Then suddenly , there will be the nasty A taste that is bitter .I may decide to question myself and go for another half a jar . But that jar will be so frigg’n tongue curling horrid that I know for sure it is time to switch off . Now fun fact is those last few jars , the nice one , the suspect one and the horrid one will all measure pretty much the same on an alcmeter . ….’cause you can have high ABV tails from a reflux still just the same as you can have high ABV hearts . Which is why I don’t trust meters and do trust my tongue.Every time I have gone “ surely I won’t notice that last half jar in the mix “ …..I bloody do and hate the lotOnce you have tasted super clean Neutral , you can’t “ un taste “ not so good Neutral . And super clean Neutral requires stripping of the wash first .My recommended goto .wiki/index.ph … ion_Theory
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